cadiaN: "We're not all playing to our philosophies and principles"

Heroic are not at their best, but it's all about perspective for cadiaN. "At the end of the day, there are only two or three teams in the world having a better time than us right now," he says.

HEROIC is going into ESL Pro League Season 18 after a 5-6th place finish at IEM Cologne and a semi-final run at Gamers8. Those could be considered decent finishes, but it's not enough for the world's No. 2 team. Results "haven't been awful, but we're definitely aiming to have very different kinds of results compared to the last two tournaments," the team's skipper told HLTV during the Maltese tournament's media day.

Part of the problem is the high bar set by Casper "⁠cadiaN⁠" Møller in the rest of HEROIC, which perhaps makes them cast their recent results in a harsh light, but what worries the Dane is the team's inability to play proficiently in the style that has propelled them to the top of the ranking and their title run at BLAST Spring Final right before the summer break.

Date	Matches
ESL Pro League Season 18
06/09/2023	HEROIC 16:00 Rooster	Match

cadiaN spoke of some of the team's struggles since returning to play after the break and some of the problems arising from the team not following their principles in the server, whether that's part of a larger trend or just a momentary lapse, and how their 'gamble CS' actually stands on solid foundations upon further scrutiny.

How is the team feeling after your last two tournaments, Gamers8 and IEM Cologne?

We are currently not playing up to the level that we're supposed to and that we're capable of. That's due to multiple different reasons. There has maybe been a small dip in individual form from more or less all of us, but I'm not talking a lot, just 1% or 2%.

When rewatching the games, or during the games, the feeling I have is that we're not all playing to our philosophies and principles and the way we want to handle the game.

I can't say that, with the level we played at, I'm surprised that the results haven't been better. They haven't been awful, but we're definitely aiming to have very different kinds of results compared to the last two tournaments.

You talk about a drop in individual form. What do you think it is, that results in you not playing to your philosophies?

I wish I knew. I definitely think we tried to address a lot of things in practice the way we usually do, talking about how we want to approach areas of the map, how when we see X we want to do Y, and dry-running strats to try and trick some opponents.

Then, when we play games, I spectate situations I know that we have set agreements about how to react in these situations and we don't withhold the standard that we're supposed to. So yeah, I'm not surprised at all about the losses because I don't think we've been playing well at all. It's very frustrating. Also, to be fair, the bar has just been set super high at Heroic in terms of how we want to play and how we want to perform.

Semis at Gamers8 and quarters at Cologne, it's just not good enough results for us anymore. One thing is the results and the other thing is the process of how you play. What has been disappointing me the most is the way we've been handling ourselves inside of the game.

Is it anything that concerns you or is it a bit of a rough patch and something you'll be able to get yourselves out of?

I'm concerned, I'm not going to lie. One thing is if other teams are becoming better or if the things you've practiced and done are outdated, and another thing is just not being able to do the things that you're good at, at the same level you once did.

My concern is that it's us dropping in execution and theory, the way we want to do those things. I know that all of the players on the team are more than capable of playing at this level, winning big trophies, and doing the right things, but for some reason, things are not going our way right now and we're trying to figure out how to get back on track.

Is there any sense that it might need a re-think of the playstyle? That stuff has become outdated? Is there a point at which you have to take a step back and re-think your playstyle a bit more fundamentally?

It would be easier to answer that question if we executed our philosophies correctly. Then, if you lost and you see that they're one step ahead... Like if they knew what we were doing when we executed correctly and were just better, then I would have an easier time answering this question. But, when we're not executing things properly, that's my worry.

If we execute things correctly and still lose, we have to look at it, but my feeling right now is that yes, people know we're aggressive, but we have also always had solutions to change the pace of the game.

We can play slow and play fast, both as CTs and Ts. We've never been that one-dimensional kind of team that always does the same things. Obviously, there are tendencies for us, like there are for any other team, but I don't think it's something that's worrying me yet.

You've probably been the most consistent elite team we've had in the last years. Does that hurt you, in a way, because everyone is watching you as one of the best teams? You've been credited with revolutionizing the meta to some degree.

Yeah, I definitely think it has made it harder. But, as you said, a lot of teams have praised us in interviews, so one of the reasons they are looking at us and copying us is because we're doing things right. Some parts, also, in a new and innovative way.

So, it's not something surprising to us, but I definitely think that when you play against teams who just recently studied a lot of your demos, they may know some of the small tricks and signals a little more than against a team that you don't study as in-depth.

Maybe it gives teams below the top 5 an advantage, but in the top 5, there are a lot of standard mind games because you play each other quite a lot and you know each other well.

You lost to ENCE at the last two events you played. Do you think it's just a case of not being quite there at the top of your game, or are they a tough team for you?

I think they're a tough team for us, but I also think that they have beaten us — at least the last two times —, when our shape wasn't really that good. We should have definitely won the Cologne match. We had plenty of chances to win the first map, we smashed them on the second, and the third one was the one that NertZ had all of those rounds on Mirage. We made mistakes, but it was also great plays by him.

Then we lost in OT on Nuke at Gamers8. I think ENCE has been playing really well, but not for that long. I think people are exaggerating a bit how long they've been playing well because they weren't even top 8 at the Paris Major. But since Dallas, they've definitely been a top 2 team. Super consistent.

They've played really well, they have a lot of players who have done tremendously, and Snappi has called a good play style. He has a good playbook and he knows when to mid-round or when to call fast-paced strats. They've been having a good run, for sure.

Looking forward to ESL Pro League. Is it a good time to be playing it? You get quite a lot of games, you get games against a range of teams... Is it a good tournament for Heroic to have right now when you're maybe not in your best form?

If things go the way we expect them to and we win the first two games on the first two days, then we don't play for four days and we play a game for seeding. That's only three games in the span of a week, which is not a lot. We'll get a lot of games if we're in trouble. If we go down to the lower bracket or last-chance qualifier.

I was very ill the week leading up to Pro League. We took a week off and then we were supposed to practice a lot, but then I got really ill and we didn't get to practice. Our preparation for the event has been super poor and other people are also feeling a bit under the weather, so it's definitely not the best conditions in regards to our current form, but with that being said I still think that the first two games in the group are must-win games no matter what.

Whether we play ENCE or MOUZ in the last game it will be tough, but that's how it should go. With this format, if we don't make it through this group, then that's really freaking bad with three chances and three teams that seem like we must not lose to and two games that we could maybe lose once but shouldn't lose both.

The group stage should be fine. The aim is to make it through this, go back home, practice hard for the playoffs, come back, and show a proper Heroic style of CS.

What are your thoughts on Heroic for the rest of the season? It's not sure when CS2 will come out, but it could be after Pro League by the looks of things. Is it a good time for Heroic to change games now, with everyone getting a bit of a fresh slate?

If people were asking me this question after the summer break I would have said the timing was pretty bad because we were No. 1 in the world and we had just won in Washington, so back then the timing was pretty bad.

Now, things have maybe changed a little bit, but I'll also say that I get the questions you ask, and my answers indicate that, but at the end of the day there are only two or three teams in the world having a better time than us right now. Not more than that. Vitality, ENCE, and G2. The rest are feeling supposedly way worse than we are, so it's also about perspective and expectations.

The fact is that we set the bar super high. We've done this ourselves, as well, because we know what we're capable of. Right now we're not delivering and maybe the bubble of waiting for CS2, things like that, they're things you're trying to address mentally, but maybe it's playing some kind of effect.

Right now I'm excited to play the new game, but with what people are saying on social media, I haven't played it myself, it seems like people aren't fully satisfied. I'm not going to sit here and say that I'm completely excited, just because it's a new game doesn't mean it's going to make us better. It's all about communication, decision-making, stuff like that.

Heroic has been one of the most consistent elite teams we've had in CS:GO over the last few years. What has allowed you to be so consistent over a long period of time? Even though you're in a down period, you're still one of the best four or five teams in the world.

The style we play is very dependent on searching for information, being proactive, making decisions... It's something that's super hard to prepare for if you're our opponent and, in my opinion, it's very percentage-based.

I try to set up a lot of situations and if we do them, then out of the four possible outcomes, three of them we are happy with. That means that 75% of the time whether we push and die, or we get the information, or they're baited into running, or we get the kill, which is nice, or we don't see anyone and we know that they're in the opposite site... It's stuff like this.

This has been super good for us for a very long time. I remember when we started to practice this philosophy a lot of people were calling it 'gamble CS', but I think ever since studying it more in detail people have realized there's a lot of theory and percentages behind that. It is a gamble, but it's a gamble in which the house wins.